Ascent: Black Sky

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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby BoshingTong » Wed May 31, 2017 4:37 pm

Wulf wrote:Just a reminder to get an your opinion on economics cost of production (it's a separate post) and subsequent colony demands and contracts.
so far had 5 resounding no's - so looks like no one really cares about the colony stuff or has any really good, easy for Jam to implement, alternatives.

Option: freeze colonies - If this is the case (no changes to the 'lifeless' colonies) I wounder about the option to 'freeze' colonies.
lest we can take colonies off-line till something does happen to make colonies worth while. I STRONGLY want to put my colonies on hold and not keep bleeding SC red ink for something that currently has no value but toke a lot of time to create.


I would vote no to freezing colonies. I love working mine. They are the back bone of my trading empire. Without those resources I would have nothing to do, as I hate mining. It would give me more time to explore, but that is secondary to me.

I don't disagree that they need work and would love to see some new tools and better use for them, but I would not stop them.
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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby RAM » Wed May 31, 2017 5:37 pm

Wulf wrote:so far had 5 resounding no's - so looks like no one really cares about the colony stuff or has any really good, easy for Jam to implement, alternatives.


Wulf, we already have some easy things in process that we hope will help. Just because we disagree with your thoughts, doesn't mean we do not care. Just because you disagree with what we want to do, doesn't make you wrong either.
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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby Wulf » Thu Jun 01, 2017 12:24 am

RAM wrote:
Wulf wrote:so far had 5 resounding no's - so looks like no one really cares about the colony stuff or has any really good, easy for Jam to implement, alternatives.


Wulf, we already have some easy things in process that we hope will help. Just because we disagree with your thoughts, doesn't mean we do not care. Just because you disagree with what we want to do, doesn't make you wrong either.



sorry did not see any alternatives, sorry for the frustration, all i saw was criticism and no proposals. I will remove post.
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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby davh62 » Thu Jun 01, 2017 6:27 am

Wulf wrote:
RAM wrote:
Wulf wrote:so far had 5 resounding no's - so looks like no one really cares about the colony stuff or has any really good, easy for Jam to implement, alternatives.


Wulf, we already have some easy things in process that we hope will help. Just because we disagree with your thoughts, doesn't mean we do not care. Just because you disagree with what we want to do, doesn't make you wrong either.



sorry did not see any alternatives, sorry for the frustration, all i saw was criticism and no proposals. I will remove post.


Wulf. Debate & discussion is healthy. It leads to progress one way or another. Your input is important. I'm also heartened that it's sparked the forum into life again.
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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby Mooncrest » Thu Jun 01, 2017 7:33 am

Wulf,

Your economics post made me have a long think about the economy and I am still enumerating my options. In the mean time I have PMed you about how I could help you .
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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby Novicius » Sat Jun 03, 2017 12:52 am

I believe I have said that before but it is a new question so i will say it again:

Old players need more robots!

Why? Ascent is exiting game but after while it is like going to work not having fun. We need to be able to develop, research, build ways to have time to actually enjoy the game. As a CEO of interplanetary corporation i found it funny that i still have to personally mine my resources. Funny and annoying.

1. Mining space platform and mining space robots
2. Cargo modules
3. Full control over NPC traders with essential commands:
a) supply
b) deliver and report
c) pick up and dump
d) convoy option

There is a lot of obvious more but those are mine essentials to enjoy that game as it deserves...
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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby Mooncrest » Sat Jun 03, 2017 11:12 am

Novicius wrote:I believe I have said that before but it is a new question so i will say it again:

Old players need more robots!

Why? Ascent is exiting game but after while it is like going to work not having fun. We need to be able to develop, research, build ways to have time to actually enjoy the game. As a CEO of interplanetary corporation i found it funny that i still have to personally mine my resources. Funny and annoying.

1. Mining space platform and mining space robots
2. Cargo modules
3. Full control over NPC traders with essential commands:
a) supply
b) deliver and report
c) pick up and dump
d) convoy option

There is a lot of obvious more but those are mine essentials to enjoy that game as it deserves...

I agree with some of this, Novi, but the intention of the game designer has been to get the Player to play the game and not control automata. If we bring in automatic mining and automatic selling, then each Player can become self sufficient and that removes the need for Player interaction and co-operation which is the basic ethos of the game.

At the moment all Players need to do some mining, if they want to augment what the dedicated miners can produce. Hopefully there will be, in the future, enough dedicated miners to provide the resources that are needed by the Corporations that other Players have set up. My vision of where the game is going is: there will be Players who have Corporations that produce components and items, ships, etc. They are supplied by their colonies and a group of Asteroid Miners. The various resources and products are transported by Hauliers to either other Players Stock Markets or the NPC Local Markets and Contract Boards or Colonist Contract Boards (the latter being a recent , new proposal). In the meantime, Explorers are finding new and interesting places to set up colonies, allowing Players to expand their operations. The option of PvE combat with 'Pirates' allows those Players electing to perform this activity, some variety in their play. The same will apply to PvP, if that is ever implemented.

I think, therefore, that Mining Platforms and Asteroid Mining Robots are a non-starter. Jam just will not allow it, period.

Cargo Modules is a non-starter also. The way ships are configured means that in order to increase Cargo Space, existing modules have to be reduced in size, or modules have to be removed. Otherwise, you are adding to the total mass of the ship and that would seem to go against the physics employed in the game: there is a check against Total Mass when Hyperjumping, failure of this check prevents the jump from occurring. The way to increase cargo space is to buy/build a bigger ship.

Cargo Space in a Leviathan can be nearly 200k. The Class 16, when it finally arrives,should double this. We have to bear in mind that the cargo volume that can be shipped to the NPC Local Markets is the limiting factor on an otherwise infinite demand for goods. It is my view that Class 16+ ships should be banned from docking at NPC Stations or, at least, their turnaround time should be significant, say two minutes. That is if you turn up at a Station in a Class 16+ ship, you will be unable to dock and have to wait while the Hangar Droids finish loading/unloading you. There is already concern in the community about the quantity of goods that can be sod at NPC Local Markets, so we have to limit how much we an sell there. It seems to me that preventing or delaying the really large ships at NPC Stations is a quick and simple way to achieve this.

I fully support your suggestions for NPC commands and would add a Recall command that allows the ship the NPC Pilot is flying to return to a hangar and the Pilot to return to Crew status for reassignment.
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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby Nomad » Thu Jun 08, 2017 2:11 pm

From my perspective I still love playing this game and have been a monthly premium subscriber since it started and have purchased the DLCs to help fund further game development and noting the amount of realtime hours invested in this game to get my account where it is today I would hate to see that effort lost by restarting this game as part of any re-launch. I do believe however, that the game has somewhat stalled for me as nowadays i have nothing left to research, not really interested in fighting drones, and I spend nearly all my time just moving resources around between my space stations just to make space so that I can move resources from my Planets and finding everything is always full and then having to expand storage facilities just so I can repeat the process again. And with no more larger ships to research/build/buy the only option is to either keep expanding your NPC fleet which have their own limitations which I really have not mastered yet as most in the game just tend to hang around as space junk and end up choking the gate passageways or put your effort into building more gate systems to link more planets to provide more of the same resources which you cant get rid off already. And with Neo and Tin being in such high demand and in short supply it tends to slow the whole game down to the point where most stop chasing it and are forced to pay ridiculous prices. And dont get me started on the Stockmarket with all those ancient orders still sitting around priced at 100000% more than anyone should ever pay for it and then only be picked up buy a newbie who looses their life savings and leaves the game.

Stock Market
All new orders in the stockmarket need to be validated so that reasonable price ranges are set to prevent idiots from placing sell orders at 10000% more than what the can already be bought from and if not sold within a limited time frame they are wiped and items returned to the player or removed from game if they are nolonger active.

Contracts Board
New types of contracts need to be developed urgently to renew this once awesome feature where we get mini missions to achieve a reward. (Maybe take resources that another player is trying to Buy or Sell, or work out what components they are lacking and offer them a fragment to research for accepting a contract not just offer us the same resources we already own or can buy int he stockmarket at similar prices therefore making the Contracts board useless once you get past the 1st stage of the game. (I loved this until I noticed I was buying stuff that I already own until someone told me about the red * meant I owned it...maybe it would be better to hide the ones you already own so that you can offer new meaningful contracts that are rare to that station only to make it more interesting when they come up and we might check them every time we dock)

Shipyard
Not much to say as I was happy with this overall except maybe offer larger ships to players that are past the puddle jumping stage amd dont allow players to sell whole ships that cant fly (e.g ship hold only without its components). And also set price limit ranges to prevent ships and components from being over priced compared to Shipyard game prices (would love to buy class 1-15 ships rather than solely relying on other players or building your own)

Planets
Planets and Colonies need some re-thinking to expand the different types of resources/material a planet could produce and maybe make those resource bearing planets more rare or change the GEO ratio so that we really need to find that GEO 5 perfect planet in order to make it viable. Maybe look to integrate with Ascent - Black Skye and have different supply/demand requirements that we could interchange through the Contracts Board for us to pickup and deliver far.

Warehouses
If we are producing that much resources then the warehouses need to be bigger as building 200x200 of warehouses is not practical in real terms so the scale needs improvement. Also make sure if we run out of essential resources (like food & water) we get notified or show 0 on every item regardless of how many we have so we know its missing when we scroll down the list. Also maybe tell us how much storage is used and whats remaining from inside space station so we know its full again.

Maybe design something like perishable foods so that it rots if not kept cold (from not maintaining station) or goes off for keeping it for too long and maybe material starts to weaken or breakdown if left out in the elements for too long before being used. This way it might eat up surplus resources in the game. Also think about resources such as fuels, oils, lubricants, solar, wind to compensate those generators running all day that never get serviced. Not too mention other medical r&d, supplies and germ prevention that we pick up while traveling to other planets. Oh bring back other species or plants for making vaccines etc...done of expansion options to add new directions in the game other than moving resources all day.

System & Planet Scanning
It would be great to be able to do an initial scan of planets from when we enter that system so that we dont need to land on every planet just to get a GEO 1 toxic on Maybe have a device that scan the system and provide a summary of potential dangers and resource/habitability options before we choose to move on or add to your fav to return later.
I used to love the ability to scan in Tradewars 2002 which told us that Military/mines or other players where in the next sector and we could probe to get further information or put ship defences on before entering. Even building Defences around our own home systems to prevent hostiles from trying to take it over...rather than just shooting drones :-)

Subscription
I am too minds..I am happy to purchase the right to play that gives me all features and continue this on a subscription basis, however, I need to be told when my subscription is coming up for renewal so that I can re-subscribe before my account stops producing resources etc just because I was too busy moving resources to notice Premium had run out. (now I do it on a monthly basis rather than 3 monthly). I would also be happy to switch to free game and have in game purchases to either speed up production or research, ship building or purchase something that I cant buy/generate myself in the game that would make the game more efficient and turn on next stage once I have achieved the next (maybe lock the 270 million stars into purchasable chunks) so you cant space jump 10000 LY without some rank or status or traded map fragments that we could research or trade with Black Sky you in-game purchases

Overall I am still happy with the game though it could be greatly improved (as mentioned above) with some funding and development support and a community effort to bring in new players hopefully through this new proposed re-launch. I would hate for this game to be closed or restarted, as I could not go through the same effort again to get back to where I am now but happy for any new direction you want to take future development as long as they build on what is a great concept with lots of potential with the right marketing and support. I would also not like to see all the development effort be transferred to this Black Sky project only to have this game losses its players and eventually rust out due to lack of player involvement through no new challenges or game expansion though the thought of having another team at the other end of the universe being developed and then someday we have an almighty fight in the middle would also be great, meanwhile we could trade resources, deliver rough prisoners through contracts, and maybe defect to the other side for those that want a change allowing us to move our entire planet and resources to some dark corner never to return to Inner 9 unless to destroy our ship.

Hopefully this re-launch will also consider better release programs that provide expanded game play (structured around game evolution as universe expands and deals with shortfalls and surpluses in the game) that are thoroughly tested with major effort to remove existing bugs before new features are introduced. This in itself will clean up any negative user experience that ends up commenting on here which in turn puts other off. The once this Forum is cleaned up to better align topics and categories towards game announcements, bug identification, and game discussions all that will be required is maybe reward the Ascent community for helping bring in new players by offering in-game purchases or subscriptions to give them an intensive though most will do for free if they are passionate enough like those regulars in the game.

Regards Nomad
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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby Leprosi » Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:57 pm

Greydog wrote:
Moneyman wrote: :mrgreen: Perhaps you could illustrate how the lore could be changed? i.e. via a thread. :)


The lore doesn't need to be changed, what we have is scattered and difficult to find but good for what it is.

What we need is more ...history is never really, fully, lost there are always rumors and stories of rumors that persist as mythology and tall tales. All that happened from a civilization as advanced as ours supposedly was should still have remnants laying about even if our in-game characters know nothing of it.

A thread is a good idea though ..I'll give it some thought.


I love the idea of lore. Exploring other systems, getting a beacon call and landing on a planet to have it give up a hidden library. This is not low hanging fruit, unfortunately, sigh, sniffle ....
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Re: Ascent: Black Sky

Postby Moneyman » Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:03 pm

Leprosi wrote:
Greydog wrote:
Moneyman wrote: :mrgreen: Perhaps you could illustrate how the lore could be changed? i.e. via a thread. :)


The lore doesn't need to be changed, what we have is scattered and difficult to find but good for what it is.

What we need is more ...history is never really, fully, lost there are always rumors and stories of rumors that persist as mythology and tall tales. All that happened from a civilization as advanced as ours supposedly was should still have remnants laying about even if our in-game characters know nothing of it.

A thread is a good idea though ..I'll give it some thought.


I love the idea of lore. Exploring other systems, getting a beacon call and landing on a planet to have it give up a hidden library. This is not low hanging fruit, unfortunately, sigh, sniffle ....


:mrgreen: What I'd really like to know is ... Did the Cylons cause the fall?
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